Enzo 244 Earmark Install

[LakeSurfer 10]

Im sorry Lake for the confusion, i was just asking why you didn't do marine grade JL since they cost the same and have the same technologies like the 60% less power draw but are marine grade. Thats all, i don't want you to think i was pushing WS amps over JL amps, i think you chose well I wouldn't of wanted to spend the extra money either, especially if you got a deal if you're not keeping it outside, it really don't matter what amps you get, you're right TIGHT set up, no doubt!

 

truekaotik: I did not think you are pushing WS. I am a big fan of WS. My wife actually wishes I was not such a big fan. Reality is that I am stereo stupid and make most of my stereo decisions based on other peoples input. On my last boat, I bought all WS amps and they were great. I have since been told that you can buy better amps for the same money or as good of amps for less. So on this build, I thought I would try out the JL amps.

[duffymahoney 10]

I have the same amps and I leave my boat in the marina 4-5 months a year with zero issues so far. I have never used marine amps in any boat I have owned and I have never had an issue with any of them that wasn't because I did something stupid:)

[truekaotik 458]

I have the same amps and I leave my boat in the marina 4-5 months a year with zero issues so far. I have never used marine amps in any boat I have owned and I have never had an issue with any of them that wasn't because I did something stupid:)

X2 ^^. Lol this will be the first year I run marine grade.. I've seen alot of rusty amps in my line of work but never had one of my own.. Guess its all about how you take care of your things....

[doug743 53]

i went with jl only because there is no local support with wetsounds at a dealer level. although i have heard there are a few free lance locals that can get wetsounds at a great price and do there installs on the side. I am more concerned about someone who can do everything. I don't want to do it. tune it, or mess with it. I want to turn the key and go. I have a local shop that is all marina, and seems to know what they are doing.. maybe i will buy the ws and get them to install it.

[PayCheck 20]

That is possibly one of the nicest setups I have ever seen. The lights look sick I'll bet that thing bumps when the sub n stereo are all goin. My cousin uses JL amp to power his 12w6v2, and it works so nicely, I would recommend JL over wetsounds just from my knowledge. My instructors axis has wetsounds amps n speakers n 2 subs, it works just as nice but defanatly the single JL subs rock

[h20king 794]

Jl is great stuff.I am running ARC audio amps and love them my system is a blend for interiors I am running the bullet hollow point coax I have heard the WS interiors but prefer the sound of the bullets.As for tower speakers WS can not be beat.Subs are more a personal preference I always recommend a ported box for a boat because it's an open air environment and you need the extra punch.Personaly if I had the room I would be running an EXILE Big 15 sub in a ported box.............................................................H

http://www.exileaudi...oducts/bigsubs/

[DavidEM 1]

Not to get off on too much of a technical tangent but I would like to respond to some of the woofer comments.

Designing a woofer is like choosing the gearing in your transmission or differential. In order to get something in the way of extra performance in one area you have to compromise in another area. There is no free ride and no escaping this law. For example, if the ratio is such that you increase power and accelleration then the top end is limited or you lose gas milage at highway speed.

Its very much the same with a woofer. Increase power handling at the cost of internal efficiency. Lower mass and increase output at the cost of low bass extension. Parts are generic for most woofers. Only a select few firms actually assemble them and very, very few have proprietary parts. So each company selects their own priorities and make the necessary compromises in the process. They tell you about the objectives but in many cases conveniently omit the sacrifice.

 

I would ideally match the JL Audio M1700 monoblock amplifier with the largest JL Audio W3 series I could fit.

 

Some of the best speakers in the world are bass-reflex. Consider Wilson Audio, Dali, B&W and many more. Your music was most likely mixed on bass-reflex studio monitors. They don't build $50K and up a pair speakers for that particular buyer that sound inarticulate in the bass. However, bass-reflex is easier to screw up and a peaky or boomy or sluggish or indiscriminant sounding bass-reflex system is a product of a mis-aligned circuit. Do it right and the pitch accuracy in a boat will be as good or better than any sub enclosure alternative.

 

David

Earmark Marine

[LakeSurfer 10]

^^^ Can someone translate that in English please

[truekaotik 458]

The first part is tech crap out of a book and hard for a customer to understand...the second part he's saying pair the 1700 to the 13w3, which will beat the crap out of the speaker in a fourth order box ( ported, for the regular guys) which can damage the speaker if tuned improperly. The third part is about bass reflex subs, which almost all subs now days can be "bass reflex". Bass reflex is porting a sealed box in many different ways to achieve different frequency responses... He saying ported is harder to tune properly but produces higher spl?? I hope.... It reads like a manual.... He does have excellent book smarts on this so I'm not trying to be mean :-) so don't take my response that way...

Edited November 15, 2011 by truekaotik

[DavidEM 1]

Don't take LakeSurfer too literally. He and others get the general idea even if they don't follow every micro detail. He's just sending a little good-natured fun in my direction. But hey, if I'm not telling a little more then I'm not saying anything new, different or of substance.

I know how it is when someone else talks about the nuances of what they do. My eyes glaze over and my eyelids get heavy as its all greek to me.

 

David

Earmark Marine

[LakeSurfer 10]

Don't take LakeSurfer too literally. He's just sending a little good-natured fun in my direction.

 

Correct on both statements

[doug743 53]

why does this have to be so hard. I just want someone to put a bunch of stereo stuff in my boat that sounds good and does not break. I probably will never know the difference. I want to get good gear that sounds good that works well that will add some value, (or at not devalue the boat) my 09 had the skylon 125ib 6 of them a kicker 350x4 powering them, a single set of exile xm7's on a jl mhd 600x4 and the skylon 10inch sub from centurion with the jl m1700 powering it and i loved it. hahaha. it was fine, was loud, sounded just great and i could here is when surfing. I want a little more, it to be tuned correctly and sound good. I am really not concerned about the price, but I get confused with what i should do, only because this is not my forte) thanks for all the help

[doug743 53]

oh, i listen to country, rock, alternative, classic rock, 80's and some metal from the good old days and some retro rap, So just about whatever is on:)

[DavidEM 1]

doug743,

Okay, going back to your initial questions...

You can easily run just about any four HLCDs off of a single tower amplifier. LakeSurfer has one pair of really big HLCDs running in parallel on a fullrange monoblock amplifier. But you can run a series/parallel combination and run four tower speakers off that particular amplifier. And that amplifier is a little unique in what it does. But there are tons of two channel options that will run four HLCDs on the tower. Certainly a particular speaker or speaker combination dictates the amplifier requirement so you select the speaker first and package it with the right amplifier. What you will not find is a single chassis amplifier that will run all the in-boat coaxials plus four tower HLCDs. Running no more than four in-boat coaxials and just two tower HLCDs with a single six-channel amplifier is possible. In the final analysis I think you will be looking at three total amplifiers. Tower. Sub. In-boats. Many use a single 5 or 6-channel amplifier to drive a sub and the in-boat coaxials but you already have a very capable subwoofer amplifier.

Personally I don't think a particular type of speaker is more or less suited to a particular venue of music. I would begin with a linear (treats all frequencies with equal amplitude and displays little in the way of peaks and valleys) and musically neutral speaker/system. Heck, even recordings within the same music type and/or era can be mixed dramatically different. From there you can tune your system to fit the personality of your music and personal taste or EQ the system selection by selection or according to your usage whether that be at rest, cruising, surfing or wakeboarding. The more bias you inject into the initial design the more difficulty you will have completely removing that bias when you change music venues.

As for subwoofers...Your JL Audio M1700 is 500 watts at 2-ohms rated under the most stringent terms. The JL Audio 12W3 thermal capacity is rated for 500 watts and the 13W3 is rated for 600 watts. Good match. And these speakers are a little more responsive to that power. Now if I had a JL Audio HD750/1 I would look to a 12W6. If I had a JL Audio 1000/1 I would look toward the 13W6. Although these W6 speakers are an upgrade in power handling and excursion they are more massive and command more power to control. And in an open field boat, versus a vehicle, you can really use the extra leverage.

I hope this helps.

The more specific your questions are the more specific the answers can be.

 

David

Earmark Marine

[doug743 53]

thanks, i have already decided that i want 4 rev 10's and i will keep the new xs650 that come in the boat, i guess its really amps and a sub that keeps me confused. i read too much and it causes brain farts.lol i thought about all wetsounds and being done with it,, but i dont have any support for it in pgh pa, with that being said, my local marina has a really good stereo shop that does all the stuff but really has little experience with wakeboats. they did a good job with the jl stuff, but just didn't get the entire, 80ft, behind the boat, or surfing concept and how loud we crank on it. but they are willing to install the wetsounds stuff. so i will fester until the boat come in, should be around xmas

[h20king 794]

Doug its not hard.If you liked your old system and you are willing to drop the cash you will love love love your new system.Tell us what tower you have and we can recommend what WS tower speakers you will need.Their are plenty of guys on this forum with banging systems all you have to do is duplicate what they have.WS and all the high end marine audio manufactures stand behind their gear.Order on line just make sure they are authorized dealers and have it all installed locally......................................................H

[h20king 794]

Doug sorry just read your other posts.If you were happy with the skylon system on your old boat you would be more than happy with the complete WS stereo system available as an option on all new centurions and would come installed from the factory...........................................H

[doug743 53]

its the gladiator tower, I guess i will either end up with ws amps of jl's, this is the first boat that i sat down and ordered just the way i wanted it. i loved my malibus and my 09 enzo, but they where left overs or in stock boats, so i had to take what was there. i know that if i get jl equipment the local guys will install it and tweek it. They will with wetsounds as well but have no relationship with them.

[h20king 794]

Doug they Don't need a relationship with wetsounds.If you buy the gear From WS or an authorized WS dealer on line and have it installed WS will still warranty their product if you have any problems.Tim at WS is the man and will bend over backwards to make sure all his customers are happy and the guys at WS will even talk your installer through the tuning process and install over the phone.If you have the cash I would buy four rev10's and two WS syn 4's to power them.A syn four to power six interior speakers and a syn 1 to power a WS XS 12 sub in a custom box from earmark controlled with a WS 420 EQ.With this set up you will always be that guy and is almost identical to what wake DOC has in his boat................................................H

[DavidEM 1]

doug743,

With two pair of Wetsounds REV10s you are at the pinnacle of tower speakers so there is no where else to go there. To reach the full potential of the four Rev10s you can stack dual JL Audio MHD or HD750/1s or stack two bridged Wetsounds Syn4s. I know that sounds excessive but I am talking about the speaker's "full potential". In any case you want to think in terms of 200 honest watts bare minimum to each REV10. And, 300 watts per speaker is much better. While they will handle much more power they are actually still more efficient and louder with the identical power than the smaller REV8s even with 200 watts per speaker. But again, we are talking about reaching our full potential here.

How many in-boat coaxials do you have? If its four XS650s you could run a JL Audio XD400/4. If its six you could run a JL Audio XD600/6 with a dedicated channel per speaker. It really sounds nice when you run the amplifier a bit more conservatively and have a bit more dynamic headroom in reserve. Or, you can run a Wetsounds Syn4 to four, six or even eight XS650s. Its definitely got the power.

Since you have the JL Audio M1700 you could run one of the JL Audio W3 woofers referenced above. Or, the Wetsounds XS12 in a final 2-ohm configuration is a good woofer for that power. The XS12 is not the SPL beast that the XXX12 would be with a 1000 watts or so but I like the sound quality of the XS12. And a 12-inch in a bass-reflex enclosure is going to pound regardless.

You should select the right woofer by first determining the maximum external enclosure displacement that you have under the driver's helm cavity. The enclosure size will dictate the best option in woofer size and enclosure type. Match it up with your existing amplifier and you are there.

So there are a few blanks for you to fill in but its really no more complicated to do a balanced design amd equipment selection than the process explained above. Its the enclosure design and installation execution including tuning that will make a major difference in the final value and performance of your system.

 

David

Earmark Marine