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Tlance

Utah boat show - cool stuff and laughs

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Tlance    0

My wife and I went to the Utah boat show last weekend. Here are some of our take-aways:

We love Centurions. We own a 2015 FS44 that has a killer surf wave. Colors are awesome. Other than lack of storage, we have really enjoyed this boat. 

Anyway... The Centurion dealers at the boat show made us really laugh. The boats are awesome, but their pricing strategy is seriously up in the night! The price they are advertising for an RI257 is over $200K! (online also) The funny thing is that they are not actually trying to get that out of it. They are doing to old trick of setting the price really high, and then saying "but your price is X", as if people are that uneducated and are going to fall for the good deal trick. LOL! To top it off, the price they are actually trying to get from an RI257 is still higher than a Nautique G25!

So in Utah, if you think Nautique G23 or 25 are expensive, wait until you look at the Centurion RI237 or 257! Wow!

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BoardCo    111

We are the dealer here in Utah and can give you a bit of context here.

The price we have posted online is MSRP. It is a number that is determined by the Centurion factory and not by our dealership. This is the same for all Centurion dealerships nationwide. Per our dealer agreements, we are required to ONLY post MSRP online as the price on the boats and can't post the price we actually sell the boats for, which is why we also put "CALL FOR PRICE" on all listings.

MSRP is an arbitrary number that is primarily used to value a boat for financing purposes, which is why it is inflated considerably compared to the price we actually sell the boats for. Every boat manufacturer has a similar MSRP markup and discount for actually selling the boat. Nautique actually inflates the MSRP more than Centurion does.

As far as the prices go, in our market, a Ri237 / Ri257 sells for about $10k less than a G23 / G25, if they are optioned the same. The Nautique dealer here in Utah brings a lot of boats in stripped down to show lower prices where most of the boats we have at the boat show are fully loaded Ri boats with all the bells and whistles.

Hope that helps clarify a few things for anyone that is looking at pricing.

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Wakejunky    0

Thought I'd throw in my two cents. Sold my last boat about 5 months ago. Been keeping an eye on the market to see what interests us this time around. This will be my 6th boat purchase. Pricing is RIDICULOUS!!!!. Nothing has changed much over the years as far as sales strategies, etc. I have tolerated it for many years but it's really starting to wear on me. These grossly over inflated MSRP's just destroy any ounce of integrity in this industry. 

An RI237 has been a boat of interest for us, and I've gotten some pricing over the last few months. Basically, a fully loaded boat with 450 engine. These are some of the initial pricing I received.

New 2019 Ri237 with drop zone tower  MSRP $175,000 dealer price $126,000

New left over 2018 zero hours, decent colors, "Fall Special" was $125,000

Used 2018 factory demo boat just under  200hrs, decent colors $119,000

See a pattern here? I was a little irritated with the pricing on the demo boat. 200hrs, are you serious? That's is roughly four seasons of use for the "AVERAGE" boater. The big selling point for them was you will be the original owner, and it has a full warranty. :unsure: According to the bank and DMV maybe.........

On 2/15/2019 at 9:17 AM, BoardCo said:

MSRP is an arbitrary number that is primarily used to value a boat for financing purposes, which is why it is inflated considerably compared to the price we actually sell the boats for.

THIS statement should be a huge red flag for buyers and banks.  Auto dealers don't need inflated MSPR's to get banks to buy auto loans. Why do boat dealers need to give the bank the idea that the boat is valued at $50,000 over selling price??????? Does that create a sense of true value of the product or loose it in a mountain of BS? Again huge loss of integrity with the industry as a whole. 

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h20king    795

Boat loans are high risk for lenders. Think about it. If someone has a home a vehicle and a boat and life throws a curve ball what do you think will be the first to go? I hate the pricing but all that goes back to the crash of 08 it hit the industry hard and changed the way builders have to do business. 

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BoardCo    111

I don't disagree - MSRP pricing is ridiculous. It started with Malibu a number of years ago and unfortunately, everyone else is basically required to follow suit. For years we dealt with people coming into our dealership and saying something like "Malibu is giving us $35k off MSRP and you are only giving us $10k off???" which is why everyone basically runs on an inflated MSRP value now.

That said, the reason MSRP exists at all is for valuation for financing for banks and establishing NADA values. Higher MSRP prices equate to higher NADA values (though this is a small influence) and allow for financing options that otherwise may not be available. A lot of banks will only lend against 80-90% of MSRP and having a higher MSRP vs. actual sale number allows someone to put less down if they want, especially when factoring in costs such as freight, prep, taxes, licensing, etc. that aren't factored toward value by the bank.

The other reason MSRP is beneficial is the lower the actual amount financed to MSRP ratio, the better the rate is. If we were selling boats for actual MSRP, the interest rate on a new boat would be .25 to .5% higher than current rates and the buyer would be required to put anywhere from 20-25% down to get approved.

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Wakejunky    0

I think it would set one hell of a precedence for a company like CorrectCraft to LEAD the industry out of a marketing gimmick instead of following Malibu's corporate spin to sell more boats. Imagine if your boats were all priced 20-30% lower than the competition and have amazing build quality to boot. I'm "SURE" customers "ALWAYS" would still gravitate towards a significantly higher priced product with poor build quality just because of a "GREAT DEAL." Even if dealers had to spend a bit of time telling customers about the gimmick and pricing strategies that would instill some well deserved trustworthiness. 

I also find it dishonest to try to convince banks(as well as customers) that there is some type of equity in a product, when there clearly is not, in order to manipulate the loan percentages. If a dealer can mislead a bank, they are clearly misleading you as well, as it all trickles down to the buyer. I would think to myself "Oh, the dealer is pulling a fast one on my bank so I'll get a better rate. Wait a second if they pull a fast one on my bank, what keeps them from pulling a fast one on me." Again trustworthiness, integrity, legit pricing, equals long term loyal customers.

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InfinitySurf    289

The problem with above statement is that only informed/educated buyers think like you/us (the 1%'ers). Most people are sheep and like BoardCo said, if the "perceived discount" is way higher on a Malibu....the majority of people are not smart enough to realize that Centurion is a better boat, nor will they do the research. In their heads, the vast majority of people will think that Malibu MUST be a better boat for no other reason that its priced higher and because of the "big discount", the dealer must think they are special and they would be stupid not to get the "best boat on the market for such a great price", there is already that perception since Malibu sells the most boats due to the corporate spin and marketing gimmicks they started years ago (clearly it worked). Believe me, the banks know exactly what is going on, they are the ones who started most of these games, they HAVE to lend money to stay in business. You are not "convincing" them to do anything, they just want you to fall within the parameters that they set in place and if you do so then its all good. If it didn't work for the banks, they would change it. All they want is for their numbers to look good on their filings to their investors.

Believe me, I know exactly what you are saying and where you are coming from and in many ways at the core, agree with how you feel. Just not the way the real world works anymore cause there are not enough honorable/informed people to keep an honorable business, in business. So if Centurion does not "play the game", they could easily go under for that reason alone.

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BoardCo    111

@InfinitySurf is correct on that one. For years Centurion did things differently (essentially we sold boats at MSRP) and we had A LOT of problems. People thought that we were hosing them and it took a long time to explain why we weren't giving them a $30k discount and the other dealer was.

As far as integrity goes, a dealer should acknowledge that MSRP is an over-inflated number and if they don't you shouldn't trust them, hence my statements here on this forum.

For lending, it would put any boat company that actually sells boats at full MSRP at a true disadvantage as most banks are only willing to finance 90% of MSRP max not including tax, freight, prep, registration, etc. That means people would effectively need to put 30% down to even qualify and upwards of 40% to get the best rate. We aren't trying to pull a fast one on the banks by any means, but if I have a choice between having a program that favors the bank's equity position vs. getting our customers the best possible rate I will go with the best rates for our customers.

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@BoardCo what’s going on with the NADA and Centurions for 2019? We almost couldn’t get financing for our new boat because the website is only listing the “base” MSRP of 122 and change. 

Is there a way for Centurion to fix this? Nautique for example has a base of 154.

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BoardCo    111

@Moczygemba9395 the base MSRP has no options equipped on it at all. We haven't really run into this problem on boats as almost all banks / credit unions use MSRP sheets on new boats and don't source NADA. The NADA MSRP is correct, but when you put options on the boats it can increase the MSRP value by $50k. Nautique is the same way, they just have more features that they include in the base price (board racks as an example) instead of having them as "options". There are plusses and minuses to each way of doing it, but I don't see them making any changes with how they do it.

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DrNate    426

I'm not sure why the argument is being made whining about MSRP.  Cars are the same way.  Heck, there are a ton of products that are that way.  Nobody pays the sticker price (or shouldn't).  And it's been that way as long as I can remember

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Jonmcd    0
On 2/17/2019 at 7:46 PM, Wakejunky said:

New 2019 Ri237 with drop zone tower  MSRP $175,000 dealer price $126,000

Where are you getting this pricing?

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