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Guppydriver

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About Guppydriver

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    Fresh Fish

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    Not a Centurion
  1. S238 vs. The Usual Suspects

    Not yet. Came down with the Rona and am under quarantine for about 7 more days. Just can't spend the money until I at least demo it. I did finally make it to the Moomba dealer before I got sick and his opening offer was about 7K cheaper than the S238 for the Max. My MB dealer came in at $102K for a F22/A before tax (about 110K OTD so out of my price limit). My wife is all about saving the money, but the Max is not a very attractive boat in my opinion. It has some better features than the S238 and the dealer says that the Max wave will kill an S238 because of the depth of the hull (probably BS). I will admit the fit and finish of the Moomba were better than I thought and the storage is ridiculous, but I really like the S238. Assuming the lake demo goes OK and I see the wave potential, I think I am real close to a fair deal with Boardco. My wife needs to see a little more value and maybe a pro shop credit to help with the lead, and I think I can get her to go for it. If they could make the OTD $99,999, I would write a deposit check on the spot. (That would be about 93K before tax) What's interesting is that more than likely...if I buy a Supreme from Boardo, they are likely selling me a Centurion as well in a few years. Likewise, if I buy a Moomba and like it, they are probably getting a Supra sale in the future. I'm pretty brand loyal. Our firm/tight budget is due to a big pay reduction I took due to Covid. Once things stabilize in a few years and I'm back to the old pay scale, I could easily see myself jumping into a premium boat. I'm hoping they recognize that and get a little more aggressive, but they have all the leverage right now due to high demand.
  2. S238 pricing

    Great info Troy.. Maybe I will add the drop in lounge (the backrest lol). I guess with a child there and an adult in the OB seat, there wouldn't be a view blocking issue. The covers and what not...They are cheap...probably a few bucks a month..I'll keep them I guess the big thing is the stereo. It would be cool to have the biggest, baddest "entry level" sound at the lake, but if you think the champ with Rev 8's are good, then with Rev 10's, all the better. I do like how the hero has two subs, you don't see that option until you get into some really expensive boats. Don't think I will add the underwater or docking lights...I wanted to have a couple "bling" features after spending 100K (which is why the trailer light might be cool), but if I never use them...probably best to leave them off. The only reason I even considered the bow ladder, is because my wife sucks at her back up skills and likes me to back the boat in then climb in the boat and back the boat up while she drive the trailer away. But maybe it;s time she just cowboyed up;)
  3. S238 vs. The Usual Suspects

    Oh ok. Much better pricing than I thought. I know the factory fitted one for the S238 on wakemakers is $1199. I think it includes the piggy back back. Don't know if that takes up all your side locker space though. Would be strange to have a new boat with absolutely no storage. It says it adds 1600 pounds but that seems pretty impossible (I assume 1600 per side). Also, does that price include both sides or just one?
  4. S238 vs. The Usual Suspects

    Thanks Cam, Great Info... Not sure I want to pay a grand or more to replace the bags for only 200 pounds a side (The 21's are now shipping with 750's). Maybe I'll just up my lead from the planned 500 to 1000. That will save me some money and give a little bit of storage in the lockers when even when they are full. Getting back on track to the title of the thread, I had my apt. with the Moomba dealer yesterday. Almost closed my deal at BoardCO the day before. I'm not going to lie, the value proposition of the Moomba is pretty attractive. The Max is a very deep boat and the fit and finish far exceed Axis and NXT levels. Comparably equipped (Better Sound in the S238, but bigger screen in Max) the Max quote was 8 grand cheaper. To be fair, the S238 is a foot longer, but the Max feels big. It also has 4000 pounds of stock ballast. I assume the new Mojo will be right around where the S238 sits price wise. I like the S238 more but 8k is real money. Also, my MB dealer said he could get me a new F22/A for $102 well equipped...still out of my price range (I have to pay tax) but a killer boat for the money.
  5. S238 pricing

    Thanks Troy.. I came so darn close to pulling the trigger two days ago...BoardCo offered me an additional $1500 and they don't budge on the first service thrown in...(which to me is part of the price of the boat). The problem is we set a "hard price limit" of no more than 5 digits, and this S238 is coming out to 101,820 OTD. The Boat is $89,844 after discounts + $1250 Dealer Prep + $2950 Freight + $495 doc + Tax $6759 + Reg $522. Now this is the actual custom build I would get, and it's pretty loaded. .. I would have bought it then and there if they would have taken it to 5 digits and thrown in some lead and ropes. Really shows the sellers market we are in if they are willing to walk a sale over $1800 bucks. It has .. Hero Sound System (2 subs and 4 Rev 10's)... $3950 (2g more than the Champ) ..might be overkill but blows anything from other entry level boats away Tower speaker covers- $195 I don't know. Maybe I don't need those, but the price was the same with either two or four, so I kind of saw it as 50% off. Swimstep Cover $ 250- I don't know Bombshell Boardracks- I thought they were a good price at $1250.. I've seen competitors versions at $2500 or more. Heater.. Landing Strip Lights on trailer $395...I don't know ..might get rid of this, seemed cool though. 2 Color Gator all over boat..(includes the side rails and such) Plus all the other items that constitute a typically equipped boat NOTABLE OMISSIONS- Do you guys think anyof these are a "must have"? Underwater Lights- Cool, but would probably rarely use. Docking Lights (Thought that the trailer landing strip thing would accomplish the same thing ) Horseshoe Bag Bow Ballast - Both sales (Mitch and Berk) guys say the boat positively needs no bow ballast. Drop in forward lounge seat. If it was on the starboard side, I'd probably do it, but it kind of puts the person in the observers seat in an awkward position and blocks their view of the Stern (which kinda defeats the whole purpose) Bow Ladder on Trailer 18 inch wheels- I seriously do not care about trailer aesthetics- at all- plus 15's are cheaper to replace. HO Engine- I know I'm in Utah but the 409/410 is still more power than the other brands base motor.
  6. S238 vs. The Usual Suspects

    Man Cameron, Thanks so much for the response and info. Since I have experience behind the Axis , this really helps in making me feel more comfortable. I have an appt. with the Moomba dealer on Wednesday, but I really think the Supreme might be the best bang for the buck.... My primary reservation was not having a surfable wave to push my 200 pound fat butt ropeless. Here is a question for you. Supreme did upgrade the PNP to 750 per side in 2021. My dealer mentioned that he didn't think much more would fit in the rear lockers. I was planning on placing 200 lbs. of lead each side with the additional 100 on the surf side plus the 750 bag weight obviously. Do 1000's or 1100's even fit without having to do something to reinforce the sides or do you just not top them off? Also, Where o you put your 300 lbs. of additional lead? Thanks so much Go Oilers!
  7. S238 pricing

    So I'm not the only one left in the world without Facebook...lol Good to know .
  8. S238 pricing

    Yeah...That's what I'm afraid of. I'll see what I can do. Maybe I will be tell them that price is fine, but I want the heater and bombshells plus 500 pounds of lead and a maybe a board included. Hell, the worst they can say is no, it's just business. I don't want to throw next summer over few grand which amounts to 20 bucks a month. They are quoting me 105 on a ZS, so the S238 is really the only viable option to keep me in the five digit world. If I have a "eff you Dave Ramsey" moment and decide to increase me budget, I'll probably jump to the Vi or the MB. I appreciate your comments Troy... While I got you.. Why is this forum so quiet compared to the team talk and the Bu' forums? Even the MB forum has more activity than this one and they sell 300 boats a year. Do you think I should post my threads and the Centurion section instead?
  9. S238 pricing

    As far as what sells regionally... I'll tell ya....in Utah this year....what sells is anything that floats. I'm not sure this economy is sustainable considering all that is going on, so boat demand could drop, but I know if I want a new boat for 2021, I'll need to order relatively soon. You think I have a few bucks more to shave off that one I mentioned Troy, or is that about whee I should be ?
  10. S238 vs. The Usual Suspects

    Thanks Troy! Good to know I'm not alone in some of my evaluation. Looks like the fact that you didn't look at the NXT also corroborates that it's probably not the best fit for my needs. I agree the Zeus is a killer boat.....BUT... It's not exactly cheap and it gets close to Vi and MB territory. Very close. I know there is that one you posted in Florida, but the colors aren't our favorite (I like white hulls) and the boat has close to 100 hours IIRC, plus shipping from Florida can't be too cheap. That's why the S238 is so appealing. Legit 85K boat from a local dealer with a great rep (think you tube videos). I wouldn't expect it to surf as well as a boat costing 20-30% more, but I want it to surf well enough to justify the cost. I have no problem with putting around 500 pounds of lead in it, but not much more. I haven't looked at the ATX to be honest, they are so new, I have never even seen one on the water.
  11. S238 pricing

    I want to add to this thread as opposed to starting anything new. Keep in mind that the market is vastly different today (9-13-20) than it was in May when this thread was started. The market exploded, Not much "left over" to buy and from what I hear, the traditional winter rebate from Centurion/ Supreme has been suspended. My dealer told me that if I order today, the soonest I could have my boat would be March. Anyway...this was their initial offer on a2021 S238. The build sheet was from one they had in stock (not the one I would order), but it gives you an idea. They made a point to mention that there is not the same amount of margin as premium models..so it's kind of a no haggle price. I could never take a first offer from a dealer, but just wondering how much leverage you guys/gals think I may have. The build sheet is from a typically loaded model with no glaring omissions. Some points of note.. Does Not have the horseshoe bow bag...they say it surfs better without it??- Has the Champ Audio System, not the 4 speaker. No docking or underwater lights. No heater..Also the Gator step is very plain, not the 2 color with graphics. Standard racks...not bombshell. I'll build mine with some of these, but for the sake of this post, I just want to focus on this particular build. MSRP $119,020 PRICE $85,209 ($33,811 discount) Freight $2950 (Utah) Dealer Prep $1250 Doc Fee $495 TOTAL $89,904 Plus TTL- this is a non negotiable fixed percent/state fee, so irrelevant to the conversation. Just wondering how much room you guys think I have to wiggle in this sellers market.
  12. S238 pricing

    That is one heck of a deal for a Zeus. I saw a leftover 2020 in California on only inboards, and they quoted me 102.....no thanks.
  13. Long time lurker, first time poster, and boy I could use some advice. I know this has been discussed ad infinitum but I was looking for some fresh perspective and curious about what opinions you may have on my observation thus far. It is finally time for our family to upgrade to a surf boat that can accomodate not just our family, but friends as well. Unfortunately, we don't have unlimited resources, but want the warranty and experience of buying a new boat. I know many will say just buy a used premium model....maybe that's where we'll go, but that's another thread, and I like to keep this thread focused on brand new models. Remember there are really no more "leftover" new models to be had for ridiculous deals, so my comparison is based on new build-to-order 2021 models. I seriously feel like I have done to much research and that my head is going to explode. I have spreadsheets, catalogs, lurk multiple forums, and have watched about a thousand "walk thru" videos on youtube. My family decided to make a hard budget of five figures out the door. If there is an value/offer we can't refuse, we could sneak into the very low 100's, but it would have to be something special. Utah tax, doc fees, freight , and registration average about 10% of the price, so that puts our price limit on the boat + options somewhere in the low 90's. The boat I am absolutely in love with is the MB B52. I thought I had a shot at a classic, but it seems MB raised their prices by about 10%, which puts it in the low 100's before tax. Had I known, I probably would have ordered a month ago or so. I have my local MB putting together a quote but he is ballparking 106 ish, which puts it well out of range when you add the ancillary fees. So my quest has continued, and I'm at the end of rope, need to do something in the next two weeks before I lose my mind. Here are my observations of the boats that are at around price point, I'm very curious at what your opinions are....I will use this boat at higher elevation Utah lakes and will be used to primarily surf. We never wakeboard. When I have to, I'll bust out a tube or knee board for the younger kids, but surfing and leisure room are my priorities. 1. Axis A22/T23- Pros- Surf Wave out of the box is in amazing, legitimately surf ready when you drive off the lot. Simple to use, not much to dial in as the surf gate and power wedge are pretty much set and forget. On paper this clearly is the best boat to buy for the money for a surfer on a limited budget. This is probably what I should buy, but I have no real emotional or visceral draw to it.. Cons- Base engine can be weak at high altitudes...tower is like looking at an aborted fetus....Helm tech looks like a 1998 fish finder. The Axis' I have been on also seem to have some fit and finish issues and just don't sound or feel really well built. Free board and rough water ride could be better. This part is objective, but I am almost 50 and like classic, pretty, boats. The Axis is really edgy and aggressive in its style and it would be hard to spend 100k on a boat and not want to look back at it every time I park it. 2. Mastercraft NXT series Pros- Fit and finish seem impressive, seems sturdy. Tons of storage space. Strong base engine. Convertible rear seat. Name on the side is nice for resale. I almost wrote a deposit check for these until my neighbor told me to check out the Supreme/ Centurion... Cons- Incredibly stripped of options and customization so as not to cannibalize their higher models (4 speaker in the cabin, No bow filler available, no gator step, plain interior with a lot of fiberglass showing instead of upholstery), no walk through. No 23 foot model available. I've heard these are not very surf ready out of the box, and require a lot to get a decent wave. A little too much cost costing value for the dollar (how much are you paying for the logo?). None right now to demo 3. MB B52(classic)- Pros- Already mentioned. Gorgeous Boat- every one feels custom...powder coating...interior colors etc.., Surf Wave is pretty epic. Quick Fill Ballast also drains the PNP bags. Fit and finish seem top notch. Tons of standard features. Honestly, I was quoted around 97k (before tax and fees) a month or two ago when I started the process, I would probably make an exception to my budget if this was still the price. Cons- Increase in price. New Alpha may make the classic seem dated the before you buy it. Antiquated technology (no touchscreen). Also...Not very deep inside at all. The hard tanks take up so much space that it you never really feel like you are in the boat when sitting on the benches. Raptor 400 might not be enough at 4500-5000 feet (my lake elevations). 3 year warranty compared to industry standard 5 (big deal to me). Can't fine tune surf tabs (all or nothing surf left or right) 4. Supreme s238- The new front runner! I think it may be the most underrated boats in the industry. Pros- Value and size for your money. 24 foot boat while most others are 22-23. Doesn't seem like a "budget boat" by the quality of the materials. Vee Hull gives you a great rough water ride. 409 Engine is more powerful than the competition's motor. Now has 750 a side PNP from the factory as standard. Cons- Does it surf well enough? I need a wave with push and I will not buy portable sacks and throw a pump overboard in a brand new boat. I am willing to buy about 500lbs of lead , but don't feel like towing an extra thousands pounds to the lake or when I'm tubing the kids. No convertible rear seat. I hear rumors of a drastically changed/update S238 in the near future. None in inventory to demo. If I was sure I could produce a nice surf wave with no more than 500lbs additional lead (I don't expect it to have the same wave as a 150k boat, but I want it to be easily surfable without the rope), I would buy one tomorrow. 5. Moomba Max or Mojo- Don't really know much about them...I need to go see them... I've heard good things fit and finish wise, but I hear they are quickly getting more expensive. I don't know much about their stock wave but the boats seem very deep with tons of freeboard. I'm no the biggest fan of the big a "Moomba" on the side, but they are a hot product right now. Are they worth checking out ? Would you guys/gals generally agree with these assessments or did I drastically miss the ball? Also.. How do you feel a S238 with 500 pounds of lead (remember they have 750pnp a side now for 2021) surfs compared to the Axis A22 (with the PNP bags installed since they all have them)? Is it close? Is the Axis owner going to be laughing their butt off when they see my S238 wave???? I am going to post the price I was given for a 2021 S238 by my local dealer (who I like a lot) in the S238 price thread, I'm curious to know if you guys think I have much leverage at negotiating a better deal. Thanks so much for reading this TLDR post. LOL
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