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DaveInTahoe last won the day on June 26 2020

DaveInTahoe had the most liked content!

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About DaveInTahoe

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  1. great to hear your beeping is solved! I suspect the cable you installed is the same as the one they are using.... There is a small chance the new cable has internal shielding that the other one doesn't have, but it's unlikely. Probably it's fixed because the new clarion remote cable is not ziptied directly to the audio lines. Thanks for posting your detailed descriptions. I was planning to wrap the existing remote cable, but because you said there are zipties you can't find or reach, I also ordered another 25' remote cable from Crutchfield, and I plan to repeat the same thing you did. All I want is the beeping to stop.
  2. The most likely possibilities here are: (a) the beeping was there in the showroom and you didn't notice (b) it's bluetooth related, and you didn't test this in the showroom. you mentioned it only happens after bluetooth connect. I have not checked this on my boat, but I think it might be the same. In this case, it would be the clarion bluetooth transmit somehow leaking into the RCA pre-amp analog lines. It could be because the clarion bluetooth is getting "picked up" by the clarion control line somehow, and then transferring it into the pre-amp analog lines because of the long proximity. (c) There is a bluetooth antenna line coming out of the clarion black-box. Maybe this is accidentally routed close to some of the wire bundle. I think it's very unlikely the interference is happening entirely inside the clarion unit, as then it wouldn't go away when you disconnected the remote cable... unless you accidentally did this test while bluetooth was not connected and didn't notice. EIther way, I'm confident we will get this solved somehow. I really appreciate that you posted and did some sleuthing. Our boat is stored on a Bouy 400' offshore here in Lake Tahoe, so it's not as easy to hop out and investigate this issue right now, and most of the time we're on the boat we're using it to pull surfers!
  3. Surfing and dropping rope

    If you post a video of your surfing on the wave, we can offer you targetted suggestions... While wave tuning is important, I'm 200lbs and I can stay on the little stock Nautique GS23 wave, so if there is a wave back there you can probably stay on it with the right technique (and an efficient board). (The fastest board i've ever ridden is the Hyperlite Automatic... and it's seriously fast compared to most boards.) I've also taught about 14 brand new wakesurfers in the last two years, from never been on a wakesurf board, to dropping the rope. (and my 8 year old daughter is going to drop the rope any day now) The key lessons I give people are... 1) Move your feet back more. Almost everyone starts with their feet too far forward, which makes them not have enough "brakes" to slow, which makes them scared when they get close to the boat, which makes them ride the wave all wrong. Your back foot should be touching the rear bump-stop, and your front foot should be positioned so that you can stand balanced when somewhat on the wave with the rope slack. You get speed from shifting your weight, not from moving your feet (we will cover this in #3 below). If you are constantly "leaning back" and your back leg is getting sore, then your feet are too far forward. Move them back. 2) Move your front-foot towards the toe-edge. Most people ride with their front foot too far towards the heel side, which makes it hard for them to lean into the wave. This is fine when holding the rope, because the rope helps pull you towards the center (even when slack), but when you let go, riders tend to drift out away from the wave. Once the front foot is reasonably centered, or even a little toe-side, it's very easy to turn by turning your shoulders in the direction you want to rotate. If you find yourself "tip-toeing" to turn into the wave, or falling out the side (not over the back), this is a good sign your foot needs to move towards the toe-side. 3) lean forward and back with your hips, not your shoulders. Most new riders that are falling out of the wave dip their shoulders over forward by bending at the hip. This is not the way to lean forward. You want to straighten your back leg and bend your front leg, doing a sort of "lunge" onto the front of the board. It's a bit like a yoga warrior pose. Another way to think about it is "shifting the board behind you", which is a different way to describe the same motion. If you learn to do this correctly, unless the board is oversize, you should be able to nose-dive before you fall out of the back of the wave. Make sure you practice braking and feel comfortable slowing the board before you try this, because once you learn to put on the gas you will quickly get close to the boat and need to put on the brakes. If you are drifting "up and over" the back of the wave, you are not getting your weight forward enough. Move your hips and entire body forward by doing a lunge on your front foot. 4) Ride in the direction of the wave, not the direction of the boat. Most new riders tend to start out riding down the wave-face and away from the centerline of the boat (to the right if your goofy, left if you're regular), and then using the rope to pull back into the wave. This is not where the energy of riding is. Think about an ocean surfer inside the wave-pipe.. they ride directly in the direction of the wave. When wakesurfing, this direction is towards the centerline of the boat, *not* the direction the boat is traveling. Once you ride in the direction of the wave, you will get much more speed, and then you'll need that hip-lean and brakes to control your speed. I hope those tips help. If you can post a video of you surfing, I can probably see what's going and give you a more focused set of suggestsions or "drills" to try and train your body.
  4. Yes... The fact that they are zip-tied together for 24" makes it very likely this is where the interference is coming from. And the fact that the same analog line runs to-and-from the driver volume knob basically doubles the amount of interference in that signal line. That fact that my beeping is much more prominent on the drop-zone rear speakers suggests that it is really because those specific pre-amp analog lines are squeezed right up against the clarion remote cable, as opposed to the other pre-amp lines in the same bundle. The "insulation solution" would be to unbundle any sections where the wires are zip-tied together, wrap the digital clarion cable in EMI shielding, separately wrap the RCA preamp lines in shielding, and try to secure those wires to the boat as far apart from each other as possible, and see if that does the trick. If not, the EMI shielding might need to be connected to a ground or some large metal part to dissipate the induced current from the digital noise. The other somewhat remote possibility is that these long RCA pre-amp lines are picking up the clarion bluetooth signal.. The above shielding may be enough to fix this as well, or perhaps not. We'll have to test. Yes, those RCA cables are "pre-amp level analog sound"... We call them "pre-amp" because they are before the amplifier. This means they are very low power, which makes them very susceptible to interference. Frankly, it's a bad design to run a long analog pre-amp level audio line around through the boat to do that volume knob under the throttle, because this is always going to be very susceptible to interference. A better design is to have a control cable from those volume knobs which doesn't carry audio, but only the position of the knobs... Then a simple volume control board could be located right near the amplifiers, listening to the control-cable to tell what the volume knobs are set to. This is simple enough we could retrofit this pretty easily if the insulation attempts fail, but it's probably not necessary. ----- Centurion should really integrate the audio into the Centurion main console and ditch the clunky expensive Clarion head unit. This would provide a bunch of feature improvements, including: speed and/or RPM sensitive volume, control over bluetooth device from console screen, song information on main console, control XM/FM radio stations from main console... and those zone volume knobs could be either moved to the touch screen, or turned into signal-only knobs with zero chance for audio noise in the preamp lines. And while this has some design-cost, it would probably add some margin, as an XM tuner module is <$50, bluetooth chip is <$5, and an Si4844-A10 digital radio chip is <$15, and even a dedicated SoC subcomputer to handle real-time audio would be < $50, whereas a Clarion CMS4 plus remotes has to be $400+, and the functionality is worse. If they would open-source the Centurion console software and design, I'd do it myself and donate the improvements back to them.
  5. I got an answer from Skylon, and their adaptors do not fit the PTM edge racks. PTM Edge was able to find out that the Centurion tower bracket part number I want is "C913-1905"... so those are now on order and I'll report if they fit and get my preferred racks on the boat.
  6. You are not alone. I have *EXACTLY* the same problem with a brand new 2020 Ri257 with dropzone tower speakers. My beeping is 10x more prominent in the four rear-facing tower speakers.... I'm not sure it's even coming from any other speakers, but it's hard to tell. I'm a computer engineer, and from listening to your sleuthing, it sounds possible it's the Clarion remote control digital signaling cable is broadcasting some noisy radio interference, which is being picked up by the low-power analog amplifier input lines before they get amplified to the speakers. This kind of interference happens when high-frequency digital signal in a cable turns it into an "antenna" and broadcasts some low-power RF interference, which can then be "picked up" by a nearby analog line acting as an antenna. If you've ever heard beep-beep-beep coming out of a stereo or speakers when you set a cellphone too close, that's the effect I'm talking about. If this is the cause, then it should be relatively easy to solve by wrapping a good chunk of the clarion remote-signal-cable with EMI shielding wrap tape to reduce how much interference it transmits (ideally this wrap tape would be grounded, but this often isn't necessary) The metal-foil tape works a little better, but EMI cloth tape is much easier to use on flexible cabling. Amazon.com: 10mm x 20M 65ft Conductive Cloth Fabric Tape for LCD Laptop Cable EMI Shielding: Office Products ----- Another possible source of noise (if the clarion remote cable is already shielded) is that the long shielding in the clarion remote cable is acting as an antenna, and picking up some noise from some electrical system it passes near under the driver-dash, and disturbing the boat's ground loop through the Clarion head unit, which is then causing noise in the amplifiers. This seems much less likely to me, because if this were happening, I would expect the noise to affect all the amplifiers about the same, whereas in my boat it's most prominent in the tower amplifier channels. Yet another possibility is that the Clarion bluetooth output signal is somehow cross-talking onto the clairon-wired-remote cable, which is then being picked up the analog amplifier input lines. I'm pretty sure my beeping is there even if no bluetooth device is connected though. I'll do some testing. If it is the clarion bluetooth output cross-talking, I have some ideas about how to solve that too. Let our sleuthing continue!
  7. I have an Ri257 with a Dropzone tower... and a set of PTM Edge clamp racks I want to put on it.... Centurion has not been very help about an adaptor... Apparently Roswell doesn't want to help anyone put board racks on their tower that are not made by Roswell. You'd think making money off the very expensive tower was enough. I found these Skylon Centurion Drop Zone Adapters... they appear to have a similar mount pattern as on the PTM Edge racks, and I can imagine a world where these are the same because they are matching some other standard somewhere.. but I don't know... Will PTM Edge board racks fit these Skylon Dropzone brackets? Adapter - Centurion Drop Zone (Pair) – Skylon Sports
  8. It's not easy to capture what the wave looks like from a camera... here is a video of one of my wife's sessions where I moved the camera around enough to see some perspective on the wave (regular side). (the audio is jacked, there must have been water in the mic) 2020 Centurion Ri257 Wakesurfing Lake Tahoe - YouTube And here is one of my better 360 attempts (goofy side).. (have not nailed it yet, but I hope to this summer!) And I was *not* in charge of the playlist here. 2020 wakesurf 360 attempt - YouTube
  9. Nice! I'm boating near sunnyside often as I have friends near there. You might see us wakesurfing off the shore. Our house is east of Tahoe city near dollar point. We got some demo time in an Ri257 through charters with Justin @ Full Throttle. He operates out of Garwood Pier. 775-220-9636. Brandy @ Mellow came up for a surf session with us. As for service, Mello sent someone up to do my "20 hour inspection" and oil change here in Tahoe. You should talk to Sally Mellow. I think they had someone trained in Tahoe for some kinds of service, but for repairs that need to be done in the shop I think it needs to go to Folsom. I have some small new boat things that need warranty service (like the fuel gauge), and I'm trying to get Mellow to store it in the winter so they will trailer it down, do little fixes and store it after. (I've never towed a boat, so I'm a bit shy of my first attempt being down out of the sierras with an Ri257) --- I did a bunch of research that led to our decision, and here is a summary... I'm happy to chat more about it. Over the years, i've had a few dozen surf sessions (and some driving) on our friend's blue and gold 25LSV parked a few houses south of Sunnyside, as well as dozens of days on my friend's Ri257 in Seattle. We also went out one long demo ride on a G25. The Ri257 / Fi25 are all about the wave. In my opinion, Centurion has by far the firmest, longest, and most tunable wave -- with the least regular/goofy asymmetry. In order to get that, you compromise a bit on tech, because it uses a classic separate Clarion audio system, rather than the fully integrated audio and bluetooth controls on Malibu and Nautique. As for the waves... The Nautique-G boats have a shorter steep wave my wife had trouble riding -- but some people swear by it and I can see the appeal. Nautique has some clunky GoPro integration that's not worth bothering with IMO. The speed-sensitive volume is kinda nice. On Tahoe the O2 sensors on the supercharged engines frequently get clogged up. I find the Malibu wave mellow and predictable, but a bit soft. My wife learned on it, and likes it better than the G-wave, but she rides regular and notices the Malibu regular wave is not as steep. The unique thing about the malibu is that the boat runs virtually flat (no lean port/starboard) while surfing. It's also very very easy to setup a wave. The Centurion wave is unmistakably firmer, which we prefer. It also has a notably longer pocket, and I can drop back 15+ feet from the boat and still zip back in. The shape of the regular wave is a little different, but I can get it equally steep. I always run listed a bit, with asymmetric ballast fill... because it's a bigger cleaner wave. It's possible to run completely even ballast, and take out some of the listing, but I only do this to give people a smaller wave. From all reports, the Fi25 offers essentially the same surf wave, in a boat with slightly different design and more sporty styling. The Fi25 is bit lower freeboard / lower to the water... more like a 25LSV. We went with the Ri257 because I wanted the higher freeboard for big Lake Tahoe, I really like how the passenger side front-hold in the Ri257 is gigantic because the batteries are recessed into the floor, and I like some of the classier styling cues and chunky handles on the Ri257. Covering off on the tech compromises... I find the Centurion wave-gismo setup UI a bit less streamlined.. I'm a tech guy, so it's no problem for me to operate it, but I could see some being confused by the way it works. Once you get the wave settings setup, you just choose a named rider profile and push "go", so that part is plenty easy. The quicksurf fins can quick-switch the wave like on malibu, but there is no wireless wristwatch control. We have never been into wave-side-switching. My friend does it on his Ri257 in Seattle. The console tech on the Malibu is much more slick... especially bluetooth. The Centurion is a classic clarion unit, which works fine.. but it is a bit annoying in that the only way I can find to switch to a different bluetooth source is to disable bluetooth on the currently connected phone. We just leave my phone connected and always run the music from it. There is also no built-in speed-or-rpm sensitive volume adjustment on the Clarion stereo Centurion uses (at least not that I'm aware of). This is something that's really nice in the Nautique (and I think Malibu) tech console. I bought an aftermarket "boost box" that plugs into the Clarion as a "remote" and detects the boat fore-aft tilt to auto adjust the volume, though I have not installed it yet. These tech shortcomings were more excusable when Centurion was indepedent and the price was a bit cheaper.. but now that they are owned by Correct Craft, the prices have pretty much equalized.... but what are you going to do... once you ride the Centurion wave it's really hard to go back!

    Here is a picture of the interior (standard white, hex black, hex deep bronze, with canadian blue metalflake on the hard insets)

    2020 Ri257 (w/LSX). Canadian Blue Sparkle and White. Interior is standard white, hex black, hex deep bronze. I'm not swooned by the bombshell racks, so I have a set of PTM Edge wide-mouth clamp racks I'm trying to figure out how to get the right brackets to get mounted. Sorry for the kids tubing pic, its' one of the few I have with the interior. Our adults crew is 95% wakesurf.. and we hope to get the kids into it too. (my kids are only 6 and 8 y/o)
  12. Bilge and bouy parking?

    I was not able to find the test-knob, but I turned off the boat battery while the pump was running and it kept running, so that confirmed for me that it runs even with the battery off... that gives me the confidence to turn the battery off when I leave the boat out there on the bouy. Thanks @volzalum
  13. Bilge and bouy parking?

    I think i found my answer. The bilge is normally automatic as long as the battery is on.. and the switch on the console forces it to run even if the float days isn't triggered... So it looks like all i have to do is leave the battery on.
  14. Does the Ri257 bilge have a water sensor to trigger it, or does it just run forever if turned on? I read some advice that when overnight parking on a bouy, one should leave the battery and bilge on.. but when i turn on the bilge it seems to run and run, and i don't know if it will eventually turn off. Any advice?
  15. Quick followup.. I went with the Ri257 (with the LSX) -- in all honesty because the Ri is more of a known quantity for me. I've spent 30+ hours on two different Ri257s, and I love the boat. It also became obvious from BoardCo answers that having the same hull means the boats are so similar it comes down to preferences. I was able to finally see an Fi23 in person, and overall I like the calmer RI styling and slightly higher freeboard for big Lake Tahoe, so that's the way I went. We took delivery two days ago.. and we couldn't be happier. Picture below. @BoardCo - Thanks so much for all your help answering questions on here, and posting awesome youtube videos of Centurions on the water! They really made a large purchase decision much easier. Your answer above helped me shed the FOMO of not having the Fi ski-pylon. @Duneit - We bought from https://www.mellomarine.com/ in Folsom, CA. Sally and Brandy have been fantastic to work with. Sally (the owner) negotiated the COVID-modified Tahoe boat inspection restrictions for us to get it in the water asap, and has been great.

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