Boat Upgrade

[DaveB 5]

I'm sure this is going to have lots of opinions . It is time to upgrade from my 2005 Avalanche. I am leaning to a newer RI237. Centurion did a hull design change/upgrade? in 2018 so not sure if I should be looking for a 2018 or newer or if a 2016/2017 would be fine? Not sure if I should be concentrating on the RI or look for other models as well, all we do now is surf , the body can't handle wakeboarding anymore . Any and all input will be very much appreciated. Thanks in advance

[Troy. R 198]

I’m not sure on the hull design change in 2018. You are going to have the same running surface and surf tab system on a RI, FI, or VI. The Supreme ZS232 has basically the same running surface as well with some very slight changes like the staggered chine system (helps balance the ride and clean the goofy wave). The big differences among all of these models are the depth inside/freeboard height, weight, and available ballast. If I recall correctly, the FI has the windshield pushed back slightly as well giving a little more bow area and a little less cabin area, but it’s marginal.

The RI will be the heaviest and have the most ballast.

The FI and ZS are next (about the same total weight)

The VI will have the lowest freeboard, least ballast, and least total weight.

And of course the ZS will not have as fancy of screens etc. as the Centurions.

Last year when I was doing a similar search (looking for a surf specific boat as well) I narrowed it down the the FI and ZS. Ultimately I went with a ZS.

[DaveB 5]

Thanks for your info. Its so confusing with all the choices a lot to take in and consider. The hull design change in 2018 apperantely increased fuel economy by 50% improved the wakeboard wave and maybe downgraded the surf wave a tiny bit.

[Troy. R 198]

The best advice I can give is to go climb through them at a local Cent/Supreme dealer (provided you have one near by).

We had a budget of ~$100k pre-tax and wanted a minimum 23’ boat. The local dealer wouldn’t go under $140k for a RI, so it was out. They also said the FI23 and ZS232 would out-surf the VI24. They actually said (their words) the ZS wave is a little better that the FI. They had a FI23 that had been on the lot for a while that they were asking $120k for. I thought there was some negotiating room there, but they wouldn’t budge. I ended up finding a steal on a new leftover 2019 ZS in Orlando and pulled the trigger. I hadn’t even tested one yet, but I was confident I wouldn’t be disappointed. I was right!

I also should have mentioned one of the “cons” of the ZS v Centurion modeled is that the ZS doesn’t not offer Ramfill. They have essentially the same hard tank running from driver to stern under the floor, but it’s pump fed. Takes about 9min to fill.

[p5Cent 2]

12 hours ago, Troy. R said:

The best advice I can give is to go climb through them at a local Cent/Supreme dealer (provided you have one near by).

We had a budget of ~$100k pre-tax and wanted a minimum 23’ boat. The local dealer wouldn’t go under $140k for a RI, so it was out. They also said the FI23 and ZS232 would out-surf the VI24. They actually said (their words) the ZS wave is a little better that the FI. They had a FI23 that had been on the lot for a while that they were asking $120k for. I thought there was some negotiating room there, but they wouldn’t budge. I ended up finding a steal on a new leftover 2019 ZS in Orlando and pulled the trigger. I hadn’t even tested one yet, but I was confident I wouldn’t be disappointed. I was right!

I also should have mentioned one of the “cons” of the ZS v Centurion modeled is that the ZS doesn’t not offer Ramfill. They have essentially the same hard tank running from driver to stern under the floor, but it’s pump fed. Takes about 9min to fill.

Sounds like the surf wave was the primary consideration when ruling out the Vi, were there other things that steered you away from it?  I've been considering either a Vi24 or Fi23.  Have you had any difficulty with getting service from your local dealer in AZ on a new boat you bought in Orlando?

Edited January 3, 2021 by p5Cent

[Troy. R 198]

That wasn’t the only factor. Freeboard/depth inside and price were also factors. When you see them side by side on the trailer the RI/FI/ZS are all noticeably taller than the VI. That wasn’t a deal breaker, but a consideration. After years of sinking my ‘07 Avy rub rail under water, more freeboard seemed desirable. On price, I wasn’t interested in a VI22, and my local dealer wasn’t willing to get into my budget on a VI24. After that I didn’t really explore deals on VI24’s in other areas. All that said, I did feel that the VI would likely need extra weight (lead or other) to create the same wave when considering total weight.

FI23 is 5300 boat + 4850 ballast = 10,150

ZS is 5450 boat + 4600 ballast = 10,050. 100lbs less than the FI, but the ZS hull is a “tapered vee”. Very similar to the Centurion “opti-vee”, but with a slight taper in the rear meaning less hull needing less weight to displace water.

VI24 is 5250 boat + 4800 ballast = 10,050 but in a foot longer boat. Meaning more hull needing more weight to displace water.

I have had my ZS in the local shop for some warranty work. They gave me a little crap but overall treated me well.

Here’s a good video walking you through the differences in the Centurion line:

 

[Troy. R 198]

I should probably explicitly state, I’m not trying to steer anyone away from a VI, or toward any other. Just stating what I found in my search/discussions with the local dealer. My new boat search actually started with the VI24. I think it’s a great “happy medium” between the flagship RI and the Supreme line in options and price. Like anything else, it has its pros and cons. 

[DaveB 5]

Thanks Troy; All the info from your boat search experience is exactly what I am looking for. Thanks for your time and input.

[Troy. R 198]

3 minutes ago, DaveB said:

Thanks Troy; All the info from your boat search experience is exactly what I am looking for. Thanks for your time and input.

Happy to help. It’s a big EXPENSIVE decision!

[Bigcatpt 408]

13 hours ago, Troy. R said:

That wasn’t the only factor. Freeboard/depth inside and price were also factors. When you see them side by side on the trailer the RI/FI/ZS are all noticeably taller than the VI. That wasn’t a deal breaker, but a consideration. After years of sinking my ‘07 Avy rub rail under water, more freeboard seemed desirable. On price, I wasn’t interested in a VI22, and my local dealer wasn’t willing to get into my budget on a VI24. After that I didn’t really explore deals on VI24’s in other areas. All that said, I did feel that the VI would likely need extra weight (lead or other) to create the same wave when considering total weight.

FI23 is 5300 boat + 4850 ballast = 10,150

ZS is 5450 boat + 4600 ballast = 10,050. 100lbs less than the FI, but the ZS hull is a “tapered vee”. Very similar to the Centurion “opti-vee”, but with a slight taper in the rear meaning less hull needing less weight to displace water.

VI24 is 5250 boat + 4800 ballast = 10,050 but in a foot longer boat. Meaning more hull needing more weight to displace water.

I have had my ZS in the local shop for some warranty work. They gave me a little crap but overall treated me well.

Here’s a good video walking you through the differences in the Centurion line:

 

Troy... Great detailed info man!  

[Troy. R 198]

9 hours ago, Bigcatpt said:

Troy... Great detailed info man!  

Thanks @Bigcatpt!

I wish this site was what it used to be. Back in the day there was so much traffic and so much good info. Heck, your Avy ballast thread inspired me to do my Avy ballast install. A thread like this would have been at least 2 pages by now. 

I don’t do social media so this is my only place to get my off-water boating fix.

[p5Cent 2]

On 1/3/2021 at 9:18 AM, Troy. R said:

That wasn’t the only factor. Freeboard/depth inside and price were also factors. When you see them side by side on the trailer the RI/FI/ZS are all noticeably taller than the VI. That wasn’t a deal breaker, but a consideration. After years of sinking my ‘07 Avy rub rail under water, more freeboard seemed desirable. On price, I wasn’t interested in a VI22, and my local dealer wasn’t willing to get into my budget on a VI24. After that I didn’t really explore deals on VI24’s in other areas. All that said, I did feel that the VI would likely need extra weight (lead or other) to create the same wave when considering total weight.

FI23 is 5300 boat + 4850 ballast = 10,150

ZS is 5450 boat + 4600 ballast = 10,050. 100lbs less than the FI, but the ZS hull is a “tapered vee”. Very similar to the Centurion “opti-vee”, but with a slight taper in the rear meaning less hull needing less weight to displace water.

VI24 is 5250 boat + 4800 ballast = 10,050 but in a foot longer boat. Meaning more hull needing more weight to displace water.

I have had my ZS in the local shop for some warranty work. They gave me a little crap but overall treated me well.

Here’s a good video walking you through the differences in the Centurion line:

 

This is really great information, thanks for sharing it along with your thoughts and experiences.  This is my first boat purchase, I appreciate you taking the time to post.  I have been considering either Vi24 or Fi23 and have had the same concerns on the freeboard/storage depth.  Demo'd the Fi, but not seen the Vi on the water.  Mostly sold on the Fi, but a new Fi23 is out of reach and used inventory nearby is limited.  Thought I'd consider new Vi24 (assuming they could offer it in-budget), which would make me more comfortable buying sight unseen.  Just having a hard time getting past the low profile of the Vi24.

[jtryon 24]

23 hours ago, Troy. R said:

I wish this site was what it used to be. Back in the day there was so much traffic and so much good info. Heck, your Avy ballast thread inspired me to do my Avy ballast install. A thread like this would have been at least 2 pages by now.

agreed.  when doing my typhoon build i had a lot of questions that sat unanswered, so i just had to dig for the info here and on other sites.  i at least want to start a thread outlining what i've found out during my build once it's complete in hopes it might help someone else down the road.

[DaveB 5]

p5Cent; I'm just curious is something steering you away from the RI, I am leaning to the RI but having a hard time finding a used one?

[p5Cent 2]

17 hours ago, DaveB said:

p5Cent; I'm just curious is something steering you away from the RI, I am leaning to the RI but having a hard time finding a used one?

Would definitely prefer an Ri, my budget is mostly what keeps me away.  There are a few nice Ri on the market around the country.  I want one with heat, and prefer to have closed loop cooling to simplify winterization by eliminating the need to drain the heater core.  I expect to winterize myself to give me the option of using the boat over winter if the opportunity arises.  It seems Centurion went to closed loop in 2020, and used 2020 seem to be in the 140k+ asking, which is decidedly over budget.  It would probably not be that bad to deal with the added complexity of draining heater cores on a slightly older Ri, something I am keeping in mind if I see the right boat.

[Troy. R 198]

So as previously noted, I wasn’t aware of the RI hull change in 2018. I did a little looking into it. The original RI (2016-2017) was more of the traditional deep-V “Enzo” style hull. 2018 is when they introduced the opti-V. That said, I would imagine the surf wave on a ‘16-‘17 would be great, but I am not sure if it would have the same wash on the goofy side as the Enzo’s and Avalanche though. Prior to riding behind an opti-V or tapered-V, the 2014 Enzo 244 was the best wave I had ever ridden. The opti-V is just next level. It will also create an equivalent wave on the goofy side if you have any goofy riders in my crew (it was never an issue when I had my Avy, but now the kids are older and surf, 2 of the 3 are goofy). Not to knock the ‘16-‘17, but if I were in the market for an RI, I would limit me search to 2018 and beyond.

Hope that helps.

[danbolinlives 1]

I feel like you pay a lot more for an RI without any increase in performance over an FI.  I have a 2019 FI23 with the 450 and most of the options and only ended up paying $105k .  The RI has a few extra nice touches, but for an unreasonable increase in price in my opinion.  But wtf, all of these boats are unreasonably priced anyway.  We looked at a VI as well, but we boat on Powell a lot and wanted the extra freeboard.   And storage.  The VI really has almost no room under the seats. 

[Troy. R 198]

3 hours ago, danbolinlives said:

I feel like you pay a lot more for an RI without any increase in performance over an FI.  I have a 2019 FI23 with the 450 and most of the options and only ended up paying $105k .  The RI has a few extra nice touches, but for an unreasonable increase in price in my opinion.  But wtf, all of these boats are unreasonably priced anyway.  We looked at a VI as well, but we boat on Powell a lot and wanted the extra freeboard.   And storage.  The VI really has almost no room under the seats. 

$105k for a FI is a pretty good deal! Did you buy new or used?

[danbolinlives 1]

It was used (~100 hrs)  .  It was definitely a good deal.  Best price on a comparable boat I found was $5k more.  

[DaveB 5]

Well I bit the bullet and went new. Got a 2021 FI23. Just love it so far. Quite the upgrade from a 2005 Avy, but that boat never missed a beat and never let us down once. Going to miss it but it went a young family that is going to have a lot of fun with it. Trying to change my profile and FI aren't on the list, lots of models I never heard of but no Fi23.