S238 vs. The Usual Suspects

[Guppydriver 2]

Long time lurker, first time poster,  and boy I could use some advice. I know this has been discussed ad infinitum but I was looking for some fresh perspective and curious about what opinions you may have on my observation thus far. It is finally time for our family to upgrade to a surf boat that can accomodate not just our family, but friends as well. Unfortunately, we don't have unlimited resources, but want the warranty and experience of buying a new boat. I know many will say just buy a used premium model....maybe that's where we'll go, but that's another thread, and I like to keep this thread focused on brand new models. Remember there are really no more "leftover" new models to be had for ridiculous deals, so my comparison is based on new build-to-order 2021 models. 

I seriously feel like I have done to much research and that my head is going to explode. I have spreadsheets, catalogs, lurk multiple forums, and have watched about a thousand "walk thru" videos on youtube. My family decided to make a hard budget of five figures out the door. If there is an value/offer we can't refuse, we could sneak into the very low 100's, but it would have to be something special. Utah tax, doc fees, freight , and registration average about 10% of the price, so that puts our price limit on the boat + options somewhere in the low 90's.

The boat I am absolutely in love with is the MB B52. I thought I had a shot at a classic, but it seems MB raised their prices by about 10%, which puts it in the low 100's before tax. Had I known, I probably would have ordered a month ago or so. I have my local MB putting together a quote but he is ballparking 106 ish, which puts it well out of range when you add the ancillary fees. So my quest has continued, and I'm at the end of rope, need to do something in the next two weeks before I lose my mind. Here are my observations of the boats that are at around price point, I'm very curious at what your opinions are....I will use this boat at higher elevation Utah lakes and will be used to primarily surf. We never wakeboard. When I have to, I'll bust out a tube or knee board for the younger kids, but surfing and leisure room are my priorities. 

 

1. Axis A22/T23- 

Pros- Surf Wave out of the box is in amazing, legitimately surf ready when you drive off the lot. Simple to use, not much to dial in as the surf gate and power wedge are pretty much set and forget. On paper this clearly is the best boat to buy for the money for a surfer on a limited budget. This is probably what I should buy,  but I have no real emotional or visceral draw to it..

Cons- Base engine can be weak at high altitudes...tower is like looking at an aborted fetus....Helm tech looks like a 1998 fish finder. The Axis' I have been on also seem to have some fit and finish issues and just don't sound or feel really well built. Free board and rough water ride could be better. This part is objective, but I am almost 50 and like classic, pretty, boats. The Axis is really edgy and aggressive in its style and it would be hard to spend 100k on a boat and not want to look back at it every time I park it.

 

2. Mastercraft NXT series

Pros- Fit and finish seem impressive, seems sturdy. Tons of storage space. Strong base engine. Convertible rear seat. Name on the side is nice for resale. I almost wrote a deposit check for these until my neighbor told me to check out the Supreme/ Centurion...

Cons- Incredibly stripped of options and customization so as not to cannibalize their higher models (4 speaker in the cabin, No bow filler available, no gator step, plain interior with a lot of fiberglass showing  instead of upholstery), no walk through. No 23 foot model available. I've heard these are not very surf ready out of the box, and require a lot to get a decent wave. A little too much cost costing value for the dollar (how much are you paying for the logo?). None right now to demo

3. MB B52(classic)-  

Pros- Already mentioned. Gorgeous Boat- every one feels custom...powder coating...interior colors etc.., Surf Wave is pretty epic. Quick Fill Ballast also drains the PNP bags. Fit and finish seem top notch. Tons of standard features. Honestly, I was quoted around 97k (before tax and fees) a month or two ago when I started the process, I would probably make an exception to my budget if this was still the price.

Cons-  Increase in price. New Alpha may make the classic seem dated the before you buy it. Antiquated technology (no touchscreen). Also...Not very deep inside at all. The hard tanks take up so much space that it you never really feel like you are in the boat when sitting on the benches. Raptor 400 might not be enough at 4500-5000 feet (my lake elevations). 3 year warranty compared to industry standard 5 (big deal to me). Can't fine tune surf tabs (all or nothing surf left or right)

 

4. Supreme s238-  The new front runner! I think it may be the most underrated boats in the industry.

Pros- Value and size for your money. 24 foot boat while most others are 22-23. Doesn't seem like a "budget boat" by the quality of the materials. Vee Hull gives you a great rough water ride. 409 Engine is more powerful than the competition's motor.  Now has 750 a side PNP from the factory as standard.

Cons- Does it surf well enough? I need a wave with push and I will not buy portable sacks and throw a pump overboard in a brand new boat. I am willing to buy about 500lbs of lead , but don't feel like towing an extra thousands pounds to the lake or when I'm tubing the kids.  No convertible rear seat. I hear rumors of a drastically changed/update S238 in the near future. None in inventory to demo. 

If I was sure I could produce a nice surf wave with no more than 500lbs additional lead (I don't expect it to have the same wave as a 150k boat, but I want it to be easily surfable without the rope), I would buy one tomorrow.

 

5. Moomba Max or Mojo- Don't really know much about them...I need to go see them... I've heard good things fit and finish wise, but I hear they are quickly getting more expensive. I don't know much about their stock wave but the boats seem very deep with tons of freeboard. I'm no the biggest fan of the big a "Moomba" on the side, but they are a hot product right now. Are they worth checking out ?

 

Would you guys/gals generally agree with these assessments or did I drastically miss the ball?

Also.. 

How do you feel a S238 with 500 pounds of lead (remember they have 750pnp a side now for 2021) surfs compared to the Axis A22 (with the PNP bags installed since they all  have them)? Is it close? Is the Axis owner going to be laughing their butt off when they see my S238 wave????

 

I am going to post the price I was given for a 2021 S238 by my local dealer (who I like a lot) in the S238 price thread, I'm curious to know if you guys think I have much leverage at negotiating a better deal.  

 

Thanks so much for reading this TLDR post. LOL

[Troy. R 198]

I have not surfed the S238, but from reading threads on this site, they do require some extra weight. There’s a good S238 wave thread here on this site that would give you more info on that. I’m sure you could add bags under the seats (your dealer could probably do it for you) and even piggyback them onto the PnP. Also, if the 750s don’t fill the locker, you might want to upgrade them to a larger size.

I did a similar analysis a few months back. I came down to the ATX 24, Axis T23, ZS232, and S238.

I had a similar evaluation of the T23, low freeboard, garbage rough water ride, lower quality dash/technology.

ATX was BIG, deep, a lot of freeboard, but the fit/finish was a little lacking (felt/looked cheap to be honest). I didn’t get to the point of a water test.

Talking to the local dealer and them knowing surf was my #1 priority they steered me toward the ZS over the S238. I, like you, did not want to carry lead. I was ok with adding bags, but preferred not to.

The ZS is a monster out of the box! No need for any extra weight. Awesome surf wave on both sides. Fit/finish/dash/display are really nice. It’s HUGE! Huge freeboard. Great rough water ride. The ZS is a little sensitive side to side based on crew placement.

[Guppydriver 2]

48 minutes ago, Troy. R said:

I have not surfed the S238, but from reading threads on this site, they do require some extra weight. There’s a good S238 wave thread here on this site that would give you more info on that. I’m sure you could add bags under the seats (your dealer could probably do it for you) and even piggyback them onto the PnP. Also, if the 750s don’t fill the locker, you might want to upgrade them to a larger size.

I did a similar analysis a few months back. I came down to the ATX 24, Axis T23, ZS232, and S238.

I had a similar evaluation of the T23, low freeboard, garbage rough water ride, lower quality dash/technology.

ATX was BIG, deep, a lot of freeboard, but the fit/finish was a little lacking (felt/looked cheap to be honest). I didn’t get to the point of a water test.

Talking to the local dealer and them knowing surf was my #1 priority they steered me toward the ZS over the S238. I, like you, did not want to carry lead. I was ok with adding bags, but preferred not to.

The ZS is a monster out of the box! No need for any extra weight. Awesome surf wave on both sides. Fit/finish/dash/display are really nice. It’s HUGE! Huge freeboard. Great rough water ride. The ZS is a little sensitive side to side based on crew placement.

Thanks Troy!

Good to know I'm not alone in some of my evaluation. Looks like the fact that you didn't look at the NXT also corroborates that it's probably not the best fit for my needs.

I agree the Zeus is a killer boat.....BUT...

It's not exactly cheap and it gets close to Vi and MB territory.  Very close. I know there is that one you posted in Florida, but the colors aren't our favorite (I like white hulls) and the boat has close to 100 hours IIRC, plus shipping from Florida can't be too cheap. 

That's why the S238 is so appealing. Legit 85K boat from a local dealer with a great rep (think you tube videos). I wouldn't expect it to surf as well as a boat costing 20-30% more, but I want it to surf well enough to justify the cost. I have no problem with putting around 500 pounds of lead in it, but not much more.

I haven't looked at the ATX to be honest, they are so new, I have never even seen one on the water.

[Troy. R 198]

I hear you on the ZS cost. I probably would have bought a S238 if I didn’t find the deal I did on my ZS.

Shipping isn’t as bad as you might think. I paid $2k to ship from FL to AZ.

The S238 is a nice boat. I’ve climbed all through one. I just haven’t surfed behind it. I do know with some dialing it will throw a real good surf wave. Maybe the best of the boats you listed in the original post.

ATX is just the “budget” brand of Tige...

mid BoardCo your local dealer?

[Cameron 4]

I own a S238, my neighbor just bought an A22. We have surfed each other’s boats. Here are the findings:

A22 -  besides the obvious 2ft length difference, the wave is good, not great. Surfs well out of the box, wave can be tall or short but is not long. It felt like I was surfing against the back of the boat the entire time, in fact my buddy handed me a beverage off the back of the boat and I didn’t need to surf up to him to grab it. 
 

S238 - you will either need more then 500lbs of lead or get the dealer to upgrade the bags to at least 1000’s. I have 1100’s and the wave was amazing. I had lots of compliments from my other neighbor with a G21. Getting an amazing wave is an addiction so I added 300lbs of lead this summer and the wave got even better and I am happy with it and won’t be adding anymore weight. When the A22 owner was finished surfing behind my S238 his exact words were, “ Wow that wave is long, I didn’t think you could surf that far behind a boat. How can I make my wave that long?”

The boats speak for themselves. You didn’t mention anything about going on a demo with any of the boats but I would suggest to demo them and see how you like them. If your dealer sells lead take some on the S238 demo so you get a true comparison.

Final thoughts (unbiased as I am not afraid to admit if another boat is better then mine): With a bit more weight then you mentioned the S238 will surf just as well if not better then the 160K+ boats. We were in the same boat as you, no pun intended, for a budget and we feel we nailed it with this boat.

Goodluck with your search.

[Guppydriver 2]

5 hours ago, Cameron said:

I own a S238, my neighbor just bought an A22. We have surfed each other’s boats. Here are the findings:

A22 -  besides the obvious 2ft length difference, the wave is good, not great. Surfs well out of the box, wave can be tall or short but is not long. It felt like I was surfing against the back of the boat the entire time, in fact my buddy handed me a beverage off the back of the boat and I didn’t need to surf up to him to grab it. 
 

S238 - you will either need more then 500lbs of lead or get the dealer to upgrade the bags to at least 1000’s. I have 1100’s and the wave was amazing. I had lots of compliments from my other neighbor with a G21. Getting an amazing wave is an addiction so I added 300lbs of lead this summer and the wave got even better and I am happy with it and won’t be adding anymore weight. When the A22 owner was finished surfing behind my S238 his exact words were, “ Wow that wave is long, I didn’t think you could surf that far behind a boat. How can I make my wave that long?”

The boats speak for themselves. You didn’t mention anything about going on a demo with any of the boats but I would suggest to demo them and see how you like them. If your dealer sells lead take some on the S238 demo so you get a true comparison.

Final thoughts (unbiased as I am not afraid to admit if another boat is better then mine): With a bit more weight then you mentioned the S238 will surf just as well if not better then the 160K+ boats. We were in the same boat as you, no pun intended, for a budget and we feel we nailed it with this boat.

Goodluck with your search.

Man Cameron,

 

Thanks so much for the response and info. Since I have experience behind the Axis , this really helps in making me feel more comfortable. I have an appt. with the Moomba dealer on Wednesday, but I really think the Supreme might be the best bang for the buck.... My primary reservation was not having a surfable wave to push my 200 pound fat butt ropeless.  

Here is a question for you. Supreme did upgrade the PNP to 750 per side in 2021. My dealer mentioned that he didn't think much more would fit in the rear lockers. I was planning on placing 200 lbs. of lead each side with the additional 100 on the surf side plus the 750 bag weight obviously.  Do 1000's or 1100's even fit without having to do something to reinforce the sides or do you just not top them off? Also, Where o you put your 300 lbs. of additional lead?

 

Thanks so much

Go Oilers!

[Cameron 4]

On 9/14/2020 at 4:09 PM, Guppydriver said:

Man Cameron,

 

Thanks so much for the response and info. Since I have experience behind the Axis , this really helps in making me feel more comfortable. I have an appt. with the Moomba dealer on Wednesday, but I really think the Supreme might be the best bang for the buck.... My primary reservation was not having a surfable wave to push my 200 pound fat butt ropeless.  

Here is a question for you. Supreme did upgrade the PNP to 750 per side in 2021. My dealer mentioned that he didn't think much more would fit in the rear lockers. I was planning on placing 200 lbs. of lead each side with the additional 100 on the surf side plus the 750 bag weight obviously.  Do 1000's or 1100's even fit without having to do something to reinforce the sides or do you just not top them off? Also, Where o you put your 300 lbs. of additional lead?

 

Thanks so much

Go Oilers!

I installed the reinforcement kit just to be safe. The kit is a cheap piece of mind. The bags don’t fill completely full but they fill to at least 950lbs or more. Putting that into perspective at 950lbs that eliminates your 200lbs of lead back there and you can put it elsewhere. 
I am 6’3” 205lbs depending on the season lol and I surf ropeless with no problems. The board plays a huge factor too. If you are riding a board that isn’t meant for your weight it will feel like the wave sucks because you can’t stay in it. I found this out when I demo’d a board that was meant for 185lbs max.
 

Lead placement depends on how many people I have in the boat but 85% of the time I run 200lbs port side and 100lbs starboard only because majority of the people I surf with are on the port side. All of my lead is placed under the midship seats as far back as it will go. I do this on purpose to lengthen the wave even more as it is already plenty tall. I thought I would move the lead around more then I actually do but even when I switch to a goofy wave I leave the lead where it is because the wave is always better on the goofy side anyways.

Thanks for the enthusiasm on the Oilers aha maybe next year.

[Guppydriver 2]

Thanks Cam,

Great Info...

Not sure I want to pay a grand or more to replace the bags for only 200 pounds a side (The 21's are now shipping with 750's). Maybe I'll just up my lead from the planned 500 to 1000. That will save me some money and give a little bit of storage in the lockers when even when they are full.

 

Getting back on track to the title of the thread, I had my apt. with the Moomba dealer yesterday. Almost closed my deal at BoardCO the day before. I'm not going to lie, the value proposition of the Moomba is pretty attractive. The Max is a very deep boat and the fit and finish far exceed Axis and NXT levels. Comparably equipped (Better Sound in the S238, but bigger screen in Max) the Max quote was 8 grand cheaper. To be fair, the S238 is a foot longer, but the Max feels big. It also has 4000 pounds of stock ballast. I assume the new Mojo will be right around where the S238 sits price wise. I like the S238 more but 8k is real money. 

Also, my MB dealer said he could get me a new F22/A for $102 well equipped...still out of my price range (I have to pay tax) but a killer boat for the money.

[Troy. R 198]

I think you're overestimating the bag swap out cost. Flyhigh 1100's ate $213 each at WakeMaker.
The advantage of water weight over lead is, you can't get rid of the lead. It's there when you're cruising and it's there when you're trailering. I know a lot of people use lead, but I have never been a fan. I'd be more in favor of adding bags (maybe piggybacking of the PnP) under the Port/starboard seats. Just a thought.

[Guppydriver 2]

1 hour ago, Troy. R said:

I think you're overestimating the bag swap out cost. Flyhigh 1100's ate $213 each at WakeMaker.
The advantage of water weight over lead is, you can't get rid of the lead. It's there when you're cruising and it's there when you're trailering. I know a lot of people use lead, but I have never been a fan. I'd be more in favor of adding bags (maybe piggybacking of the PnP) under the Port/starboard seats. Just a thought.

Oh ok.

Much better pricing than I thought. I know the factory fitted one for the S238 on wakemakers is $1199. I think it includes the piggy back back. Don't know if that takes up all your side locker space though. Would be strange to have a new boat with absolutely no storage. It says it adds 1600 pounds but that seems pretty impossible (I assume 1600 per side). Also, does that price include both sides or just one? 

[Troy. R 198]

The 1100 lb bags are $213 each, so total of $426.

Lead is over $1 per lb. leadwake.com has 50lb bags for $62 ea.

[Troy. R 198]

@Guppydriver any update?
Did you place an order?

[Guppydriver 2]

On 9/21/2020 at 9:32 AM, Troy. R said:

@Guppydriver any update?
Did you place an order?

Not yet.

Came down with the Rona and am under quarantine for about 7 more days. Just can't spend the money until I at least demo it. I did finally make it to the Moomba dealer before I got sick and his opening offer was about 7K cheaper than the S238 for the Max. My MB dealer came in at $102K for a F22/A before tax (about 110K OTD so out of my price limit).

My wife is all about saving the money, but the Max is not a very attractive boat in my opinion. It has some better features than the S238 and the dealer says that the Max wave will kill an S238 because of the depth of the hull (probably BS). I will admit the fit and finish of the Moomba were better than I thought and the storage is ridiculous, but I really like the S238. Assuming the lake demo goes OK and I see the wave potential, I think I am real close to a fair deal with Boardco. My wife needs to see a little more value and maybe a pro shop credit to help with the lead, and I think I can get her to go for it. If they could make the OTD $99,999, I would write a deposit check on the spot.  (That would be about 93K before tax)

What's interesting is that more than likely...if I buy a Supreme from Boardo, they are likely selling me a Centurion as well in a few years. Likewise, if I buy a Moomba and like it, they are probably getting a Supra sale in the future. I'm pretty brand loyal. Our firm/tight budget is due to a big pay reduction I took due to Covid. Once things stabilize in a few years and I'm back to the old pay scale, I could easily see myself jumping into  a premium boat. I'm hoping they recognize that and get a little more aggressive, but they have all the leverage right now due to high demand. 

 

Edited September 23, 2020 by Guppydriver

[Troy. R 198]

That makes sense.

I agree on the Moomba fit/finish. It was much better than I anticipated too. I still think the Supreme fit/finish is a little better, but Moombas are 2nd of the “budget” brands IMO.

My local dealer also told me that the Axis T23 wave would blow the ZS232 wave away, so take that Moomba Max comment with a grain of salt.

Best of luck, and keep us posted!

[Guppydriver 2]

7 hours ago, Troy. R said:

That makes sense.

I agree on the Moomba fit/finish. It was much better than I anticipated too. I still think the Supreme fit/finish is a little better, but Moombas are 2nd of the “budget” brands IMO.

My local dealer also told me that the Axis T23 wave would blow the ZS232 wave away, so take that Moomba Max comment with a grain of salt.

Best of luck, and keep us posted!

I will!!

I know the ZS and S238 are two different animals, but if I could get even CLOSE to a T23 wave in a S238 I would be happier than a pig in you know what. My best friend just bought a 2020 T23 and for all the aforementioned things I don't like about it, the surf wave isn't one of them...It's legit.

[Troy. R 198]

I’ve heard the T23 is legit, but I would be surprised if you couldn’t at least match it’s wave with a S238. Before my ZS, the best wave I ever surfed was one of the 2014 Enzo 244’s that pulled the worlds. I have not surfed the S238, but I have heard when dialed properly It can be similar to a 244.

[Jetter 1]

Another factor you guys have yet to consider is fuel economy.  I would consider myself an intermediate to advanced surfer.  I am a big guy at 6'4" and about 230lbs.  I have surfed an S226, a 2019 G23, a 2019 Malibu MXZ, and many Tige's (Z1, Z3, RZ1, R21, RZ2, VE22, 22V).  One noticeable difference is the Malibu (and I'm assuming the Axis) with that wedge is BRUTAL on gas.  The wedge in my opinion is like dragging an anchor.  The wave was great but we went through 50 to 60 litres (13 to 15 gallons) of fuel per hour in the MXZ.  To be fair, we had it loaded heavily with peeps and max weight.  There is no question the fit and finish on the Nautique and the MXZ are second to none.  Gorgeous boats.  But in your price range (which is also mine) you want to make sure you are happy with what you want the boat to do.  If you are a family who does several activities like wakeboarding, kneeboarding, and surfing you want a boat that can do all of them well.  We are primarily surfers.  95% of our boat time is surfing so I am looking for a boat that can deliver the biggest wave.

I found my buddies 2016 S226 to have a nice clean wave that is long but has zero push.  He is a bit of a noob when it comes to boats.  He only owned it for one summer and surfed it with the starboard side quickfill empty the whole time.  He only discovered he had a valve stuck open right before he sold it.  So that said, I was surfing it without quickfill weight on my side (goofy).

I am considering an S211 to replace my 08 Tige Z1.  Time to go newer with an automated surf system.  I like the supreme line and think it is probably the best value out there.  I am disappointed that owners seem to need to add a bunch of additional weight to a new boat that is marketed as a surf boat.  

The only true test is get the boats you are considering in the water and see the wave for yourself.

[Troy. R 198]

Totally agree on the wedge. My dad used to have a Wakesetter 247 and while the wedge is effective, you also see it in fuel consumption. I have a ZS232 and have been pleasantly surprised with the fuel consumption rate for a 5450lb boat running 4600lbs of ballast. We filled the tank (81 gal) and were able to go out 3 times and still had +/-20% fuel left.

Coming from a 2007 Avalanche, I love having Quicksurf. In the past before the kids were old enough to surf on their own, it wasn't a problem because nearly everyone that ever came out with us surfed regular. Now, 2 of my 3 kids are goofy, so being able to switch sides in seconds is awesome!

I've never been on a S211, but considering that the S238 requires some extra weight, I would expect the same for the 211.

[Guppydriver 2]

3 hours ago, Jetter said:

Another factor you guys have yet to consider is fuel economy.  I would consider myself an intermediate to advanced surfer.  I am a big guy at 6'4" and about 230lbs.  I have surfed an S226, a 2019 G23, a 2019 Malibu MXZ, and many Tige's (Z1, Z3, RZ1, R21, RZ2, VE22, 22V).  One noticeable difference is the Malibu (and I'm assuming the Axis) with that wedge is BRUTAL on gas.  The wedge in my opinion is like dragging an anchor.  The wave was great but we went through 50 to 60 litres (13 to 15 gallons) of fuel per hour in the MXZ.  To be fair, we had it loaded heavily with peeps and max weight.  There is no question the fit and finish on the Nautique and the MXZ are second to none.  Gorgeous boats.  But in your price range (which is also mine) you want to make sure you are happy with what you want the boat to do.  If you are a family who does several activities like wakeboarding, kneeboarding, and surfing you want a boat that can do all of them well.  We are primarily surfers.  95% of our boat time is surfing so I am looking for a boat that can deliver the biggest wave.

I found my buddies 2016 S226 to have a nice clean wave that is long but has zero push.  He is a bit of a noob when it comes to boats.  He only owned it for one summer and surfed it with the starboard side quickfill empty the whole time.  He only discovered he had a valve stuck open right before he sold it.  So that said, I was surfing it without quickfill weight on my side (goofy).

I am considering an S211 to replace my 08 Tige Z1.  Time to go newer with an automated surf system.  I like the supreme line and think it is probably the best value out there.  I am disappointed that owners seem to need to add a bunch of additional weight to a new boat that is marketed as a surf boat.  

The only true test is get the boats you are considering in the water and see the wave for yourself.

The problem is finding a dealer with a boat to put it on the water..lol

 

If I could see a damn S238 wave and know that it had enough push to pull adult newbies around (me)... I would not even deal with Axis and Moomba.... 

This sounds stupid, but I wish I would have never even walked in the Moomba dealer...I thought I would be underwhelmed, but I wasn't. Very deep storage to put big bags in and the fit and finish were nice. Stereo didn't compete with the Supreme, but it was newer design, with better seating and storage options, a 7 inch screen and a FAE. All for 5-7K less. 

The Supreme has the V Hull, fit and finish that are at least as good and probably better, and of course the obvious....it's more than a foot longer (but not as much freeboard). 1st service is also included at every other dealer in the state except for mine ...lol. 

 

C'Mon BoardCo....$1800 bucks and a pro shop credit to help with ropes and lead and I'm all yours !!!!

[Guppydriver 2]

Just an update...

 

Been a tough year to even find someone to even give you a demo. I can't even get some dealers to answer emails. There was one dealer who was willing to go above and beyond in every aspect of the process. They begged me to go out on the lake with them so they could show me their wave. They also gave me great money for my trade on my I/O (which saves sales tax), first service free, and threw in a number of options I wasn't going to get as part of the deal. 

Anyway...I put in a deposit today for a MB F22/A with delivery in April. NIce deep boat that will compare with the ZS more than the S238.. Paid 100K OTD..(The S238 was 102K, the ZS was 112K after sales tax). Dealer is only 9 minutes from my door, and my wife got to customize every aspect of the boat.

Hope you guys still let me contribute to this board, as I have learned quite a lot and want to continue  to do so. I also feel like I can contribute to people during the sales and research process as I am super detailed and meticulously went over every detail of about 10 different boats!