Quicksurf Tuning

[nownow 5]

Hey all - new to an Ri217.  After she found her way from NW Boat Sports to central NC, we're finally getting to play around with the setup.  One thing that I've been looking around for and can't find is general directional guidance on all of the little knobs on the boat.  I'm assuming that the knobs have the same general effect on all of the boats (217, 237, 257) even if the sweet spot settings end up different.

What I will says it it took me years to "perfect" my 2012 VTX (no surfgate), and I loved that wave.  First surf on this one and I LOVED IT.  Wave felt a little more mellow, which is great for my skim, but had insane push back to 20' off, for my 200# self.  The width of the pocket that far back really impressed me, and I'm sure it's not optimal yet.

So I guess to my question.  My current setup for LEFT is Rams full, rear PnP full, Center 80, Center PnP 0, Stinger 30, Right tab 80, CATS -10.  120# steel in left locker. 80# steel in right locker.

When tuning, what would I expect changes to do.  (In other words, taller, longer, more lip, more mellow, etc):

Increasing/decreasing the center tab will:

Increasing/decreasing off surf tab will:

More/less center weight (standard or PnP) will:

Moving CATS more negative/positive will:

If this is out there somewhere and I missed it via search, then maybe someone could point me in the right direction.  One of the things that excites me the most about this boat was the ability to have lots of little fine knobs to craft the wave.  

Thanks!

[InfinitySurf 302]

I am going out Weds on a 2017 RI217....if they do well setting up the boat, I will take pics of the settings for you.

[LKASurfing 53]

Center tab = the lower the number, the steeper (also shorter) the wave will get

Surf Tabs  = same principle. 80 is pretty mellow. I have had better luck in the 60 - 65 range when running an evenly weighted boat. This will steepen the wave & create push in the back then use center trim to adjust to taste. 

CATS = Should be to the right, so + 10  or more

[InfinitySurf 302]

So went out on the 2017 RI217 this afternoon, Lot of fun and a great wave. We had 10 adults...so that will effect settings some cause we had a lot of extra weight, but here is a good starting point anyway for regular side surfing (we did goofy for one guy and it was totally different).

First, listing boat some definately helped to clean up the wave.....so 100% Ramfill on surf side and 80% on non-surf side, all plug and play in rear 100%. We had 3 adults in the bow, so only set front at 60% full....but with less people I would say fill it up (maybe a little less on non-surf side). The harder we listed it with people weight, the more curl the wave got.

On "surf left", Center tab 30....left tab 0....right tab at 70. CATS @ -7

I noticed that PnP had to be overriden to fill up all the way, so check that your bags are getting full as they had not set their timers properly yet. Same for Ramfill...fill till it dumps water. Once you know how long it takes you can set your timers and you will know they are filling 100%. 

If wave seems "washy", drop some of the non-surf side weight. Hope this helps get you going.

[Darkside 248]

Infinity nailed most of the valid points.   The CATS portion is a different beast.  Generally point CATS towards the rider, more cats = steeper.   Pointing cats away can create a Malibu shape, just firmer.   If your pointing away, a bit more list helps.  100/80 in the rams.  

CATS should also be the last knob you turn.  Get you ballast, tabs, speed set, then fine tune with cats.

[nownow 5]

All awesome information and exactly what I was looking for. Thanks so much!

Can't wait to get out this weekend and start dialing it in!

[SteveV 0]

On 2017-10-05 at 1:38 PM, nownow said:

All awesome information and exactly what I was looking for. Thanks so much!

Can't wait to get out this weekend and start dialing it in!

Hey @nownow, I’m just taking my Ri217 out next week, wondering what settings you ended up using to dial it in?  I feel like I forgot everything from last season.  

Thanks! 

[nownow 5]

I've still been playing around with it this spring.  This was the first weekend I had a chance to really experiment.

This weekend, for a left side surf, where I ended up was: Rear PnP 100%, Left Ram 100%, Right Ram 80%, Surf Tab 65, Stinger from 65-75, no bow or center.  Also had the CATS at +25 and 120lb solid weight in transom and 80lb left locker shelf.  I think we spent the most time with the stinger around 68, but it seems to vary from run to run to get the wake I'm looking for.  Super clean face.  Loved the wake.  Still need to play with CATS some more.

Right side is way easier to get to look pretty.  Ran that with both Rams full and higher (80-85) stinger, though that was only for our 12yo who weighs next to nothing, so she didn't need a ton of push, nor could she really comment on push.

I plan to play around with bow weight vs. stinger.  What I've seen (and it makes sense) is that as you add bow weight you bring the stinger tab down (we'd run 80% bow and 45 or so stinger) because essentially the bow weight is doing some of what the higher stinger does in flattening out the boat.  I'm not sure which I like more yet, but I'm hoping to find out.

To all - wondering what kind of RPM you're seeing on the Ri217.  This setup is running about 4000 for me with the 409, which struck me as a bit high, but just wondering if that's normal.

Edited May 14, 2018 by nownow
New ideas

[nownow 5]

For reference, this is about what those settings did.  If I had to guess, I'd say this was just a little on the higher side of the stinger tab settings.  Knocking 2-3 off this would steepen it a little.  The perspective is a little wonky but you can see the general shape and such. 

Edited May 14, 2018 by nownow

[InfinitySurf 302]

12 hours ago, nownow said:

I've still been playing around with it this spring.  This was the first weekend I had a chance to really experiment.

This weekend, for a left side surf, where I ended up was: Rear PnP 100%, Left Ram 100%, Right Ram 80%, Surf Tab 65, Stinger from 65-75, no bow or center.  Also had the CATS at +25 and 120lb solid weight in transom and 80lb left locker shelf.  I think we spent the most time with the stinger around 68, but it seems to vary from run to run to get the wake I'm looking for.  Super clean face.  Loved the wake.  Still need to play with CATS some more.

Right side is way easier to get to look pretty.  Ran that with both Rams full and higher (80-85) stinger, though that was only for our 12yo who weighs next to nothing, so she didn't need a ton of push, nor could she really comment on push.

I plan to play around with bow weight vs. stinger.  What I've seen (and it makes sense) is that as you add bow weight you bring the stinger tab down (we'd run 80% bow and 45 or so stinger) because essentially the bow weight is doing some of what the higher stinger does in flattening out the boat.  I'm not sure which I like more yet, but I'm hoping to find out.

To all - wondering what kind of RPM you're seeing on the Ri217.  This setup is running about 4000 for me with the 409, which struck me as a bit high, but just wondering if that's normal.

4000rpm is high to me, maybe you should look at your prop and do some tweaking. I run 3400rpm in my 24ft boat (with the ZR409 engine) and have 5k lbs of ballast and in comments from others that I have heard, I think the average is 3500-3600....3800 at most. Manual says you do not want to run 4000rpm and higher for "extended intervals". Wonder what prop they put on there, do you know the number? Assume you know, but its located on the prop right where nut screws on...I know your elevation is not that high in NC, if you have plenty of low end torque, you should be able to either get larger diameter or change the pitch, maybe they just put the wrong prop on there...I have seen that happen a few times since dealer installed the prop. Since the RI217 has been out since 2016, I would think that ACME has some good info and it would be worth a call to them tho best pricing I have found is Nettle Props in Austin, TX...you can call them too.

Wakemakers says for a 2017 RI217....#1235 (14.5 x 14.25) for "everything".....#1615 (14.5 x 13.75)  for wakeboard & wakesurf....#2079 (14.5 x 12) for heavily weighted or high elevation. What is your top speed and max rpm? Do you just hit 5600rpm (which is max on that engine) or does it try to redline?

[nownow 5]

Yeah, I thought so too.  I'll have to get in the water and look at the prop this weekend.  I meant to last weekend but I never got a chance.  It would seem like it would have to be something pretty weird to be adding 400-600 RPM though, like a 13.5 x 14.5 or something silly like that.  It's down 400 for every inch bigger and down 200 for every inch more pitch, right?

I think I had a 1235 (actually a 1237) on the Malibu, but that was running way lighter than this boat.  It just all struck me as odd because I had a chance to surf a Ri257 this weekend and that was running 3400-3600, so all of a sudden the 4000 didn't seem so right. 

I can surf 500' off my dock and our lake is 2 miles long.  I really don't do much WOT.  Fastest I get typically is draining the rams, and I rarely if ever get over 20 MPH.

[nownow 5]

Mis-post

Edited May 15, 2018 by nownow

[nownow 5]

To circle back on this - 

Surfed this weekend with new settings.  Liked it more.  Surf Left -  Rear PnP 100%, Left Ram 100%, Right Ram 82%, Surf Tab 70, Stinger 45, bow 100%, no center.  Also had the CATS at +25 and 120lb solid weight in transom and 80lb left locker shelf.  Wave was longer and just as tall as the no-bow settings.  Tons of push.  I recovered a few times from 3-4 feet behind the start of the curl and I'm 190 lbs.  Stinger at 35-55 can mellow or steepen this some, I'd guess.  There were max 200 lbs of people on the boat while I was surfing.

This is my favorite setup yet.  I think the angle of the boat ends up about the same but it's just drafting a little more.  Next weekend I'll likely play with the surf tab a little bit to see how the shape changes with that.  Love the fact that this isn't surfgate with one button!

Also - Prop is a 1235, 14.50x14.25 - Talking with my dealer and Spencer to spec something to drop RPM some.  Looks like there's plenty of room to upsize on the 2017, so I might end up in a 15.00x15.75 or similar.  Will see.

[SteveV 0]

Love coming back to these posts to refresh.   One thing I would add is that lead can be a game changer, depending on how big your crew is.   I use 500lbs mostly in the lockers behind the PNP bags, skewed to the surf side.   I think it may be a much in the back though, the RPMs are definitely up there - anyone else use lead and what configuration?